[LostFarmer]

I have seen some runners put on a wagon. I am looking at making a set myself. The problem I see with the whole concept of pushing a runner instead of pulling a runner. Runners work best when they are pulled from the from the runner and gets some lift.

I have build a jig that bends rectangular tube the strong direction. It is essentially a die that goes in a pipe bender crease the top of the tube to bent the runner. We have made runners from 1 1/2″ square tubing with a 2″ x 1/4″ shoe, a 1 1/2″ x 2″ tube with a 2″ x 1/4″ shoe and a 2″x3″ tube with a 3″ x 3/8″ shoe. They are big and heavy. One thing for sure make sure you put a chain on the front of the runner to keep from flipping the runner over. 😮 You could also find a set of old rims that match the bolt pattern of the hub and mount the runner on that rim. It would work in a pinch but not as good as a sleigh. Kind of like a coffee pot, alarm clock, toaster. Does it all but none of it well. LF

[LostFarmer]

These are not the exact sleighs but they are similar. We can try and get pictures when we are bed building. My grandfather was never going to have a steel sleigh. They did not work. blah blah blah… Anyway he broke the bunk on his old wood sleigh and borrowed the black and red one in the pictures below that my uncle made. He never quit using it. My uncle never got it back and eventually built him another on. I now have the black one but I put a bigger hay rack. I want to take a bigger load when I need to. The red bed looked good but was too small for all practical reasons.

[LostFarmer]

My uncle and I have just finished 2 steel sleds. They are the same size as the #4 common sense. The Common Sense and the Studebakers were the most popular in this area. We used 2″ heavy wall pipe as the roller with a 1″ bolt welded into the end. Runners are 3×2 tubing that we rolled the hard way then used 3/8 ” x 3″ plate for shoes. The hard part was building a rave that would have enough flex to work. I have one that is the same as a #2 that works great. We use a second roller and a trail tongue here but that I think is a regional thing. I back my sleigh so the chains are not an option.

[LostFarmer]

I have seen a box that the seats folded against the sides. You raised them up and a leg folded down. It worked great.

[LostFarmer]

@Carl Russell 23685 wrote:

The problem with steel is that the sled will tend to be too ridged because of the welded joins, which will have some negative effect of the function of the sled. Also the welds will have to withstand a lot of pressure.

Carl

That is true for some but I have one and J-L has a sled that is steel and will flex and move with the the best of the wood ones. The builder has figured out a knuckle that works and works well. But I agree in general a solid sled isn’t good. My grandpa always said a good sled was nearly worn out.

[LostFarmer]

Another way to look at it is to sum the moments about a point. If you pic the hitch point as the location that is in equilibrium and sum moments about that point, will get the same answers. I think your math is correct on this one. :rolleyes:

Now say on a pulling evener, if you fix the hook or allow the hook to pivot which is better. According to my calculations you could achieve the same thing with a hook that is fixed and extended back a distance.

In my case I use a simple double tree that has 1/2 inch increments that I can move a horse in or out. Leaving the hook to pivot it can make a difference to a smaller or weaker horse without having to have one horse ahead or behind to make the evener work.

My mentor and neighbor friend that got me started driving horses fabricates equipment. He is pushing 80 and still putzing around the shop daily. He once told me the longer he works on this horse stuff the more he realizes it is a mistake to get too far from the original. He has built over 50 sleighs now and about that many carts and wagons. His designs have evolved but come back to not far off the original. Another young welder kid took one of his carts to copy but did several things to make it easier to fabricate. The result was it pulled all wrong and was awkward. Humble pie tasted pretty bitter as he went back to what the old man had done.

[LostFarmer]

Round these parts we would cease to farm without twine. With twine and time look out Thomas Edison. LOL You ought to see the J-L special twine overchecks in action. Or the LF harness repairs.

I love the idea of a forecart to power a tedder and a small fertilizer spreader. Please share pictures. LF

[LostFarmer]

It wasn’t a maine accent but I had a math teacher from China. Dr. Wong used to say weckter pace. I had no idea for the first 3 days he was talking about a Vector Space not somebody messing up a horse race. I laugh about it now.

[LostFarmer]

Sounds like we will be needing and Idaho playday. Other than I am about as far from you all as possible and still be in Idaho. Snowing again here. Keeps it from getting too easy. LF

[LostFarmer]

I like the chain hitch on this one. Would be nice to have. Mine has a connection similar to the one Rod44 posted but with out a pole. It works as a brake when the tension goes off it plows into the ground. I have been using it with a team of little 500 lb welsh ponies to haul calves to the barn. I am wishing I put a front on mine. As for stout, didn’t know you could make it too stout. LF

[LostFarmer]

Depending on where you are stacking in proximity to the field use a slip instead of a loader and a wagon. We built slips that were (4) 2×12 planks connected at the front and allowed to float over the ground. We made them 12 feet long. It was real easy to tip a bale onto the slip and stack them 2 or 3 high. pull into the stack and grab a new slip leaving the other for the stack crew. We also had some with a gap between the middle planks. Easy to jam a crowbar in the gap and pull out leaving the mini stack for the stack crew. Again it worked for us as the haul was to the edge of the field. LF

[LostFarmer]

Without question an oxygen bottle would have the needed pressure rating to do what you want as an accumulator. I have thought about this a bunch. Thinking of a way to get live hydraulics to a round bale mover. The more I think about it the more I am inclined to look at a salvaged pump from a gleaner combine of a C to G model. They had a reserior, pump, and valves all on one bank. That with a little Honda motor would be a great power source. Taking that a step further would be to use the pump and an accumulator to make it happen. I am still putzing with this but some day when I have time and money this will be a reality.

LF

[LostFarmer]

I would think that an old gas bottle would work as the pressure vessle. You need enough oil to cycle any ram in your system plus a little and enough space above to compress the air. The more air space the more cycles the system will have in it. LF

[LostFarmer]

I have looked into several different methods of getting hydraulics to horse drawn stuff. One of the methods is an accumulator like was mentioned above. The concept is that you have a gas above a liquid in a reservoir. As the pump runs either by hand, cam, or other method the air in the top of the reservoir is compressed. The liquid or oil on the bottom is then under pressure. Open the valve and the liquid operates the ram. Nitrogen accumulators are sometimes used on heavy equipment to speed the ram. The pump runs constantly and then gives you a burst when the valve is opened. This concept would work well where there is time in between cycles.

It is not all that unlike a pressure tank on a water well. The air over the water allows the water to be under pressure and the pump not always on.

I have an older neighbor that is a fabricator of all things steel. He has worked horses and then builds equipment that works. He builds one of the finest steel bob sleds you will ever have the privilege of working. Light, tracks perfect, strong and plenty of flex for walking that frozen turd tundra that I spent too much time driving in. I get thinking I am a pretty smart feller until I talk to my neighbor and see what he builds and his ideas on things. I find out all I am is a fart smeller.
LF

[LostFarmer]

J-L,
Somehow that doesn’t surprise at all with Ruthie. She is one of a kind. I could see some advantages to such training and a couple of disadvantages. You teach that to those Idaho mules and I might get shot. LF

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