[Rick Alger]

Geoff,
That scenario I created was a suggestion to Robert. To clarify, I would cut and split the wood where it fell, load it on a small scoot (sled) bring it roadside and load it directly on the truck. I assumed the wood was dead and standing, and I also assumed he’d be skidding up to 600 feet as he mentioned earlier. This model would be the way to minimize handling and produce a marginally adequate volume with light draft animals.

I don’t do it this way. I skid log length and process roadside – sorting out logs and pulp – unless I can’t sell logs and pulp. (In NH you can’t sell any softwoods, poplar, or white/grey birch for firewood.)

In my experience, firewood is not a money maker. But in tough times it’s better than nothing.

[Rick Alger]

Well I brought the topic up, so I guess I’ll jump in.

Here in the northeast, firewood is a last resort for seasoned loggers. The reasons are amply explained by Jason and Carl.

In Idaho it might make more sense.

However, it’s hard to imagine the donkeys pulling the kind of logs you’re talking about whether they have an arch or not. I’ve got an arch and a good light team that weighs around 2800, and I don’t expect them to pull much more than a fourth of a cord at a turn on a steady basis. My guess is the donkeys might do half of that.

So if I was out there in Idaho with a pair of donkeys and a saw dealing with those large trees, I would probably cut and split the wood right where it fell, stack it on runners, and scoot out an eighth of a cord at a time, when I had a customer waiting and a truck at the ready.

If I could cut, split, skid and sell 4 or 5 cords a week at $200 a cord I’d feel pretty good until the Bursitis kicked in.

[Rick Alger]

Can you legally drive a 12,000# truck pulling a 13,500# trailer without a CDL?

[Rick Alger]

I use a 12′ bumper-pull stock trailer. It’s about twenty years old. I have to patch something on it every year. I generally leave my horses on site for the duration of the job, so the old trailer is adequate for my needs.

[Rick Alger]

Thank you all for the reponses.

Joel,

we have quite a bit of state and federal forest for such a tiny state, but all the work is put out to bid, and the deepest pocket gets the prize.

I agree there isn’t a large pool of folks likely to call me, but if I earn the trust of the few who do, I expect there will be repeat business. The sustainable concept of many small cuts spaced over time instead of one big final harvest is what I’m aiming at.

Hope retirement is suiting you.

Erika,

Yes, I’ve read Jason’s material with great interest. I probably should have given him a footnote in my post.

Carl,

We are a long way apart geograhically, but not philosophically. If we can find ways to further the cause, I am all for it. I am shut down now until after break-up, but I’ll be doing a cut-and-skid contract for commercial thinning in the Grant when things dry up. If your foresters want to take a field trip up here, we can work something out.

[Rick Alger]

LindaLK

Thank you.

Rick

[Rick Alger]

Jason,

Thanks for the explanation. Working on the conservation plan with landowners is ideal.

Unfortunately, I’m not a forester, so I can’t consult and sign off on “official” conservation plans. But I do plan to work on cultivating forester allies.

After mud season I’ll be taking a cut-and-skid contract from a timber company for commercial thinning of softwood logs on a wetlands site. The return will be low. but at least I can keep going, and I wont have to worry about markets and trucking.

Rick

[Rick Alger]

Jason,

Congratulations, that project at Crooked River Farm looks like an ideal application of modern horsepowered forestry.

I would love to find that kind of work, and I’m open to suggestions on how to make it happen up here in Yankee land.

Rick

[Rick Alger]

Feb. 21 was my last day on my winter job. Snow pack is over three feet. That cuts production in half and annoys the horses.

As far as markets go in northern NH, nobody is taking hardwood pulp. Hardwood pallet logs and low-grade saw logs are hard to move and bring way less than $200/mbf delivered. Softwood pulp is moving on tickets for the large contractors, but mills aren’t taking occasional loads from small operators. One collection yard I sell to is offering $17.05 a ton for delivered softwood pulp. The price of softwood sawlogs dropped $65/mbf last month. Pine is not moving. A lot of mills around here have closed also,

I am keeping busy with firewood . The forester on my winter job gave me a good bunch of standing low-grade hardwood for the taking. I’ll be fitting and moving what is already yarded, and going back for more when the snow melts. I’ve also got a 5 acre TSI project to do on snowshoes. These are both minimum wage deals.

I agree that the woods industry is on the ropes. A multi-million dollar logging outfit here in town is peddling firewood right along with the little guys.

It’s always been a boom or bust kind of business, but this time it seems worse.

[Rick Alger]

Still looking. I’m planning a trip around northern New England in a week or so to look at prospects. Let me know if you’ve got something around 15 2 that is sound and well broke.

[Rick Alger]

I had a grade Haflinger with behavior like yours. I sold him at a loss to one of the most experienced horsemen in my county. The horse ran away with him.

There are many good horses out there. Why put up with one that’s unpredictable and dangerous?

[Rick Alger]

Another problem is safety. Some horses are simply not safe to be around. Recently a friend of ours was severely injured by a rescue horse with “issues.”

It would have been far better for her if this horse had gone to the killers and never found it’s way to the rescue market.

Some folks think that “natural” horsemanship training will cure anything. It won’t.

[Rick Alger]

Years ago I read a good discussion of the older farm layouts. It might have been by Eric Sloane. The main concept was saving steps. It was the basis of the New England style of connected farm buildings.

You might talk with Les Barden about it. His place is relatively new, but it is built with the old efficiencies in mind.

[Rick Alger]

I try to work directly after each storm if the access road is plowed. Usually I have to start with light pulls or just treading the trail.

I generally cut from the back of the lot toward the front and use the same main trail constantly. This gives me a good base. (The wood is usually marked in a fishbone pattern, so I loop into the cut from the main trail on a previously use skid path, and then pull wood back to the main trail on a new skid path. )

I plan on saving areas with a thick canopy for cutting late in the winter. (A lot of the snow in dense stands never gets to the ground.)

[Rick Alger]

I’ve got a job going, and I’d love to get some help, but as I said to Tony in an earlier discussion, the landowner requires Workers Comp Insurance, and I can’t afford to buy it.

If you can find a way to self insure – maybe a training grant? – I would be glad to take you on as an apprentice with a production-based stipend.

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