brown swiss vs. holstein

[bivol]

hi!
i was wondering about an opinion because these two breeds are recommended for beginning teamsters. but i heard that brown swiss can be temperamental, sensitive and poky. how does this affect their working performance?
holsteins- how about their temperament. tell me i dont know nothing but docile.
thank you!

[Crabapple Farm]

My sense is that the reason these two breeds are recommended for beginners is that they tend to be slow moving and slow witted. On the odd occasion when they do have a thought that you didn’t tell them to have, you can usually react more quickly than they act. I’m exagerating, but you get the idea. Other breeds are harder to keep up with (mentally and physically).
We’ve got a swiss steer right now (for beef, not work), and while he might get sullen I can’t see him getting “tempermental.” He is usually one of the first ones to get to me when I bring out hay or treats, but otherwise does seem slow to move.
I don’t have as much experience with holsteins, they seem a little quicker than the swiss.
-Tevis

[Carl Russell]

Holsteins are definitely not slow, nor docile, necessarily. They tend to be pretty calm as adults, but as adolescents they can be rambunctious and rowdy.

I wonder if these are recommended because they get to working size faster?
Carl

[becorson]

Drew Conroy says Brown Swiss are generally docile and easy to train compared to, for example, Devons and Chianinas. He says Holsteins are intermediate on the docile/pokey to temperamental/ difficult spectrum.

Brown Swiss and Holsteins do grow pretty fast but “big” isn’t the same as “ready to work” . Consider horses: a 2 year old shire is bigger but probably LESS ready to do a day’s work than a 2 year old Morgan ? just “thinking out loud” here.

as far as being rowdy when they are young, most animals are, aren’t they? whether horse, ox, dog or human.

I agree with Tevis that an animal with a slower reaction time can be easier to train, especially for beginners. so much of training depends on timing. If the animal is really quick, it’s harder to get the timing right.

[Anne]

I would not say, that Brown Swiss is a perfect breed for a beginner in general.
In my opinion you have to consider both: The temperament and character of the animals you choose , and your own temperament and character. Another question is, if you are already used to work with cattle of a typical breed. If so, I would stay with it.
If you belong to an area with a local breeding tradition, I would chose that breed. In most cases the people of an area fit very well, to the cattle which are breed there.

I was used to German red and white ones (Deutsche Rotbunte), of the old dual purpose type. They were the traditional cattle of the area, I grew up. I think their character is comparable to Holstein.I found them easy to train and was very confident with them. Than we moved to Switzerland and I started to train Brown Swiss. It´s true. Brown Swiss are tame, docil and slow. Some are to slow. Their slowness is an advantage and a disadvantage.
While other breeds may react with movement, when they get into trouble, the Brown Swiss will freeze. If they dont know what to do, they will freeze and refuse to walk. Some tend to be stubborn. They are slow learners, but if they once got it, they will do it. They are very trustworthy.
At the moment I´m training two animals, to work together. One is a Brown Swiss of the old type (Original Braunvieh), the other one is a Limousin-Simmental cross.

Examples of their different character:
Teaching them to lead:
Brown Swiss: Freezes, refuses to walk.

Limousin-Simmental: Jumps, trys to run, throws herself on the ground.

Back up:
Brown Swiss: Didn´t get it for a long while. Shakes her head. Get´s angry.
Got it in the end. Walks backwards step by step, if demanded.
Will do it under all circumstances.

Limousin-Simmental: Got it very fast. Walks backwards in a high speed, for a
long distance. If something else is more interesting, it
will catch her interest. Could happen that she refuses
to back up, if she gets nervous.

First pulling experience:

Brown Swiss: slow walking

Limousin-Simmental: Tryed to run away

I personally like both animals. They teach each other a lot. The Brown Swiss calms down the L-S and the L-S speeds up the Brown Swiss. If I want them to learn something new, it´s the L-S, that shows me, if I teach it right. She will get it very fast and do it perfectly, – if she does it. The Brown Swiss will get it slower and do it slower, – but under all cirumstances. I dont know, if I would be patient enough, to train the Brown Swiss, if she were my only animal. It´s good to have the L-S, which shows me, if it is possible to understand, what I want them to do. And it´s good to have the Brown Swiss, which does it in the end!

I´m also training a group of Brown Swiss – Herford crosses. They wouldn´t win a beauty contest, but their characters are wonderful! Tame and calm as Brown Swiss, but a little faster!

[Crabapple Farm]

I think a big part of the recommendation for beginners on the holstein side is that they are so common, and hence relatively cheap. At least in this part of the world.
These days a good bit of ox “conventional wisdom” (especially among us relative newbies)can be traced to Drew Conroy, possibly including the notion that holsteins and Brown swiss are good beginner breeds. Around here, the only other common options are Jersey, shorthorn, and devon. The latter two are hard to find, and between Holstein, Swiss, and Jersey, I wouldn’t recommend someone starting with Jerseys (though I know some who have, successfully).

[Victoria Reck Barlow]

And here’s another wrinkle: The way Anne describes the difference between her Brown Swiss and Simmental steers could equally describe the difference between the two half-brother Milking Shorthorns I’m working with. So along with characteristics of the breed, there also are personality types to account for as well!

[Howie]

Every animal, the same as every human, has his very own personality.
You might get a hot Swiss and you might get a laid back Chianinia.

[Anne]

That´s an important aspect!
I´m just starting to train two Brown Swiss calves, which seem to be much more spirited, than the ones I´ve trained before!

[Author]

Posts